Quote of the day—Vincent Gray

Guns are not the answer, ladies and gentlemen. Guns would not have saved the victims of the Navy Yard.

Vincent Gray
Mayor of Washington D.C.
September 17, 2014
Gray Calls For ‘Real Gun Control’ At Navy Yard Ceremony, Says D.C.’s Laws May Be ‘Relaxed’
[Then what was the purpose of the guns in the hands of the responding police officers? And why do many of the politicians in his jurisdiction have armed guards?

This guy has crap for brains. Or else he thinks you do.—Joe]

Quote of the day—Stanley Bonk

The fastest way to lower crime rates is to get rid of guns.

Stanley Bonk
September 4, 2014
Comment to Moms’ Group Calls Out Kroger’s Gun Policy In Unprecedented New Ad Campaign
[Don’t ever let anyone get away with telling you that no one wants to take your guns.

Bonk needs to compare crime rates inside and outside the formally gun banning regimes of Chicago and Washington D.C. But I expect facts are outside his area of experience.—Joe]

Quote of the day—Scott Connors

If judges can pontificate on questions of firearms engineering, then I can write legal decisions legalizing the possession of fully automatic firearms and rocket propelled grenades by the unorganized militia (ie, us). That’s fair, isn’t it?

Scott Connors
September 4, 2014
Comment to Judge Tries His Hand at Engineering
[Yes. It is fair.

It’s also just as likely to be faulty as the judge’s engineering efforts. This, of course, was his point.

What the judge and other “smart gun” advocates apparently don’t or can’t understand is that engineering against an intelligent adversary is dramatically different and more difficult than engineering devices to reduce the probability of accidents or the mitigate the effects of such an accident.

Turn signals and brake lights reduce the chance of accidents. Seatbelts mitigate the effects of accidents. There has been little need to significantly improve the technology of these in the last 50 years.

The technology of antitheft devices has seen dramatic improvement in the last 50 years. This is because in the case of the theft of a car the engineer has an intelligent adversary working against them. Both the thief and engineer attempting to protect the car innovate nearly constantly.

And even that analogy is weak because:

  • Guns have the contradictory criteria of failing to fire if the thief removes or disables the power supply and being useable by the owner in an emergency situation if the battery or electronics have died.
  • A inoperable gun is far more transportable than an inoperable car.
  • A car has large and reliable power supply.
  • A car can be disabled for many seconds or even, in extreme cases, a few minutes without serious consequences.
  • A few pounds of anti-theft technology added to a car are not an obstacle to its use.
  • Two way communication technology is common and relatively difficult to defeat in a car. Not so in a gun.

If you are going to pontificate on “Smart Guns” you should get the advice of an engineer with experience in security.—Joe]

He shot all of us in the foot

Daughter Kim told me about this yesterday. Great. Just great:

An Idaho State University assistant professor with a concealed-carry gun permit shot himself in the foot with a semiautomatic handgun that accidentally discharged from inside his pocket in a chemistry classroom full of students, police said on Wednesday.

I expect it will be years before the damage done by this accident will fade away.

Don’t be stupid and ruin things for everyone. Use a quality holster whenever and wherever you carry a handgun.

The definition of irony

The University of Idaho vehemently opposed respecting the Bill of Rights and the Idaho State Constitution in regards to firearms. The legislature finally told them to suck it up and face reality. They have reluctantly entered the 21st Century screaming and yelling and they still don’t like it and they are doing whatever they can to make sure the students know they don’t like it.

The fall semester just started which is the first semester since the law went into effect on July 1 of this year. One professor, Dan Hickman, put the following into the syllabus for one of his classes:

The University of Idaho bans firearms from its property with only limited exceptions. One exception applies to persons who hold a valid Idaho enhanced concealed carry license, provided those firearms remain concealed at all times. If an enhanced concealed carry license holder’s firearm is displayed, other than in necessary self‐defense, it is a violation of University policy. Please contact local law enforcement (call 911) to report firearms on University property.

Apparently he wants to ostracize people who go through several hours of training and a FBI background check in order to exercise a specific enumerated constitutional right.

Daughter Kim sent me this picture from the Memorial Gym, the same location as the ROTC gun range:

V__F2FD

They create a victim disarmament  zone and then declare it a “Designated Safe Zone”?

And, as Kim pointed out:

It also bothered me that the only sign I saw in memorial gym was that one on the door to the women’s center which is supposed to be about women empowerment.

Irony. Find your definition here.

Quote of the day—Samuel Priest

Guns have been part of my life since the day I was born. I mean that literally. My father pushed the barrel of a tiny .22 into my mother’s vagina, I grabbed on, and he pulled me out. I was ushered into this world holding my first gun.

From there, I was nursed with a gun, my parents would put baby formula inside barrels of various guns and have me suck it out for nourishment. Sometimes they’d cut the formula with some gun oil, so it’d go down easier. I’d often fall asleep in my crib, a colt 45 nestled in in my mouth, dreaming of guns.

Samuel Priest
August 28, 2014
A Reasonable, Level-Headed Gun Enthusiast Suggests Small Gun Control Changes
[H/T to Bob S. who says, “Marlarkey and then some.”

The two paragraphs above are the least offensive. It goes downhill from there. He thinks of himself as a comic but I couldn’t find anything funny in his entire post. I think he has crap for brains. That he lives in Chicago probably explains the rest.—Joe]

Quote of the day—David Dunning

If you’re incompetent, you can’t know you’re incompetent … when you’re incompetent, the skills you need to produce a right answer are exactly the skills you need to recognize what a right answer is.

David Dunning
June 20, 2010
The Anosognosic’s Dilemma: Something’s Wrong but You’ll Never Know What It Is (Part 1)
[H/T to Linoge who got me started on the Wiki-wander that led here.

I found it fascinating that there have been similar astute observations on the same topic throughout history.

This is exactly what happens with many of the anti-gun people we encounter. They cannot even comprehend how disparate in competence they are when they engage us on the topic. They are frequently profoundly clueless, don’t know it, and cannot be told how clueless they are.

It find it interesting that another aspect of the Dunning-Kruger effect is that those who are highly competent tend to underestimate their skill level. Perhaps the following Twitter exchange demonstrates that:

 Lady Farmer@djmincey11 7h

@apple_butter NOBODY WANTS YOUR DAMN GUN! Understand now? @TANSTAAFL24 @KentAtwater4 @wallsofthecity @psherm07

Joe Huffman@JoeHuffman 5h

@djmincey11 You must have your head in the sand: http://blog.joehuffman.org/category/gun-rights/no-one-wants-to-take-your-guns/ … @apple_butter @TANSTAAFL24 @KentAtwater4 @wallsofthecity @psherm07

Lady Farmer@djmincey11 4h

@JoeHuffman I don't care to read your "opinion" piece. @apple_butter @TANSTAAFL24 @KentAtwater4 @wallsofthecity @psherm07

Joe Huffman@JoeHuffman 3h

@djmincey11 Factual examples are not opinions. Are you allergic to facts? @apple_butter @TANSTAAFL24 @KentAtwater4 @wallsofthecity @psherm07

Lady Farmer@djmincey11 3h

I know the difference between fact & speculation. Cognitive powers aren't magic. I'll give you a minute to Google the big words @JoeHuffman

Joe Huffman@JoeHuffman 3h

@djmincey11 For years I had the job title of Senior Research Scientist II. I know this topic well and I know you don't. @wallsofthecity

Lady Farmer@djmincey11 3h

For years I held the title of Executive Director, Reigional Director, CEO and Vice President/Owner. Now what? @JoeHuffman

Joe Huffman@JoeHuffman 2h

@djmincey11 I suggest you learn some science and educate yourself on the topic at hand. @wallsofthecity

Lady Farmer@djmincey11 2h

I suggest you KNOW your opponent BEFORE you run into battle. @JoeHuffman @wallsofthecity

Joe Huffman@JoeHuffman 2h

@djmincey11 I find it odd that you don't follow your own advice. Is hypocrisy one of your greatest strengths? @wallsofthecity

Lady Farmer@djmincey11 2h

Are we finished yet? I am bored with this sniping. @JoeHuffman @wallsofthecity

Joe Huffman@JoeHuffman 2h

@djmincey11 Only if you stop tweeting nonsense about guns, gun owners, and the enumerated right to keep and bear arms. @wallsofthecity

Lady Farmer@djmincey11 2h

And FYI... I will NEVER stop tweeting facts because it hurts your feewings. *here's a hanky* @JoeHuffman @wallsofthecity

I dropped it there because she was going off the deep end into irrationality at that point. At no point did my feelings come up in the conversation or was I even aware of having any particularly strong  feelings on the matter. And she was particularly lacking in facts.

But the point I wanted to make was that I didn’t think I was being particularly effective. Perhaps just a little bit more than holding my own.

So imagine my surprise to the following tweets in response to the exchange:

Linoge@wallsofthecity 2h

Your afternoon's entertainment: #gunsense useful idiot @djmincey11 is trying to have a battle of wits with @JoeHuffman. She came unarmed.

towerclimber37@towerclimber37 53m

@wallsofthecity @djmincey11 @JoeHuffman hahahahah she got owned.

Blackstone@bitterclingerpa 36m

@towerclimber37 @wallsofthecity @djmincey11 @JoeHuffman Owned? Broken, sold, used, traded & then sold again. Science vs a Suit

Epic.

Interesting. Very interesting.—Joe]

Quote of the day—Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn

It’s a jungle, the consciousness of an orthodox Communist. It’s impossible-to make sense of it.

Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn
The Gulag Archipelago, Volume 2: An Experiment in Literary Investigation, 1918-1956. Page 347.
[And so it is with the progressives of today. They try to use a different name but they have the same crap for brains.—Joe]

Quote of the day—kim launius ‏@kimmie8264

your all insane and don’t need to own a gun. #gunsense

kim launius ‏@kimmie8264
Tweeted on August 10, 2014
[As Linoge Tweeted in response, “It's spelled "you're", and you don't get to decide that. #gunsense #fail“.

This woman is a real gem. Here is the picture she uses for her Twitter profile:

KimLauniusTwitterProfile

And here is definitive proof she has crap for brains:

KimLauniusCrapForBrains

I case you have forgotten LBJ was a Democrat.

Don’t let anyone ever get away with telling you no one wants to take your guns.

And what is it with progressives and political violence? It must be because it’s the best chance they have for success. In the choice between brain and brawn they certainly do come up short on the brain side.—Joe]

Quote of the day—Justin Anderson

It’s strictly prohibited and we are not in the habit of making exceptions. But we certainly do everything we possibly can to make all our students feel safe. We feel that it is a top priority.

Justin Anderson
Spokesman for Dartmouth college
Gun Control Rule At Dartmouth College Denies Taylor Woolrich Protection From Stalker With ‘Rape Kit’
[I think I see the problem here. Dartmouth only cares about feelings. They care about the feelings of their students and they feel about making those feelings “a top priority”. They don’t have respect for the specific enumerated right to keep and bear arms. They ignore the reality that their feelings do nothing to protect her from the reality of a confirmed stalker intent on raping her. They ignore the reality that her carrying a defensive tool might help her as well as make her feel safer.

There was a time when people that disconnected from reality were put in mental institutions. That probably isn’t a legal option in this case but you would think they could be prosecuted for conspiracy to deny her rights.—Joe]

Gun cartoon of the day

WhatWeLove

This is what they think of the NRA. They think guns are more important to us than the lives of children. If this was true then why, after the Sandy Hook Elementary massacre was it that the NRA advocated for armed guards at schools? And why did President Obama advocate for restrictions on gun owners that would not have affected any of the school shooters?

The more accurate cartoon would have been one where President Obama is depicted as hating guns more than wanting to protect children. Every school shooting is another opportunity for him and his ilk to attack the specific enumerated right to keep and bear arms rather than mitigate or solve the problem.

I cannot comprehend these people

Here is some of what I saw at Westlake Park in downtown Seattle today:

WP_20140728_003WP_20140728_002

What are these people thinking? Where were they for the last several years as the Hamas fired hundreds, if not thousands, of rockets into Israel?

How could they not get the message that Israel has been trying to resolve this as humanely as possible and the Hamas continues to attack?

IdfCeaseFires

This is not an attempt by Israel to commit genocide. This is an attempt by Israel to defend against genocide. I find it hard to believe these people are that ignorant and that stupid or even that evil. What can they possible be thinking? They are incomprehensible to me.

This really, really irritates me. I have my gripes about Israel but on this issue I just want them to finish the job with Hamas. Show us how it’s done because it won’t be that much longer before we will have to do something similar to defend against scum like this.

Quote of the day—Mark Wilson

Here we go, some racist right wing wacko judge being an “activist”. Let’s see how fast the cowardly GOP lawmakers allow guns at the Capitol building or at their Snow White political conventions. They won’t because they are full of you know what. Meanwhile the terrorist NRA organization celebrates getting closer to another massacre of kids by some right wing nut job.

Mark Wilson
July 27, 2014
Comment to Judge: D.C. ban on handguns in public unconstitutional
[“Snow White political conventions”? “Terrorist NRA celebrates … massacre of kids by right wing nut job”?

I wonder what color the sky is in his universe.—Joe]

 

Quote of the day—Robin L. Kelly

What the Kelly Report is NOT is a manifesto against guns or gun owners. Let me be clear: I am not anti-gun. I am pro common sense. I believe America is capable of striking the right balance between protecting our Second Amendment rights and promoting public safety by keeping guns out of the wrong hands. This report strikes that balance. I trust that people on both sides of the gun reform debate will find in the Kelly Report legislative and policy proposals that their communities can get behind.

Reauthorize the Federal Assault Weapons Ban (H.R. 437—Rep. Carolyn McCarthy). The Assault Weapons Ban of 2013 would extend and reauthorize the Federal Assault Weapons Ban, an expired federal law that prohibited the manufacturing, transportation or distribution of semi-automatic weapons and ammunition feeders.

If every gun had an irremovable tracking number, it would be significantly easier for law enforcement to minimize gun trafficking and track illegal gun transfers. Similarly, inclusion of RFID (radio frequency identification) tags on guns that allow them only to fire if read by a corresponding chip worn by the owner would prevent gun violence that results from gun theft or wrongful use. The technology for smart guns currently exists.

Robin L. Kelly
Member of U.S. Congress
Kelly Report 2014: Gun Violence in America
[Don’t ever let anyone get away telling you that no one wants to take your guns. This is another member of Congress that specifically supports a ban on the most popular rifle in America. She says she wants to protect Second Amendment rights but does not give us any clue that she knows what right to keep and bear arms means. I don’t believe this is an accident. I believe she included those words only to defuse some of the criticism.

The stupidity, and/or ignorance, and/or arrogance, and/or deliberate deception is astounding in this “balanced report”. The report gives credit to over a dozen contributors but not a single one is identified as supporting gun owners or the specific enumerated right to keep and bear arms. They are all anti-gun. Yet she says, “I trust that people on both sides of the gun reform debate will find in the Kelly Report legislative and policy proposals that their communities can get behind.” Strictly speaking she is probably correct. I can find proposals in her report that I don’t oppose. I don’t see anything wrong with the following non-legislative proposals:

Promote the Understanding of and Attention to the Mental Health Needs of Students. Too often mental health issues are either misunderstood or ignored, often resulting in tragic consequences. School teachers should receive mental health training to help them better identify potential warning signs so they’re able to intervene earlier. Similarly, community groups, medical and mental health professionals should be better supported in public education and mental health destigmatization efforts that encourage people to seek mental health treatment.

Change the Social Dynamic in Urban Communities and Increase Proactive Prevention Programs in Schools. Nothing stops a bullet like a job, or a quality education. After school programs, job training programs, mentoring programs with local business leaders and community recreational programs, such as Chicago’s “Windy City Hoops,” keep kids off the streets and working towards productive futures. Additionally, alternatives to violence and conflict resolution can be promoted through mentoring programs with former gang members that inform young people of the perils of gang association and gang violence. Similarly, programs connecting urban youth with police officers will help bridge the gap and provide sensitivity and awareness training that will improve community trust of law enforcement, and assist in decreasing gang violence and police brutality.

Support Smart Policing. Proactive initiatives by police departments to prevent criminal activity, paired with an increased visible police presence in some of the most dangerous neighborhoods, are an effective means of preventing crime and gun violence. Similarly, police departments can work with local schools to target high-risk individuals—both victims and criminals—to prevent them from being placed in dangerous situations. For example, the Chicago Police Department has joined with Chicago Public Schools to promote early intervention by determining which students are most at-risk and encouraging them to enter mentoring programs and other positive activities.

But that is a minuscule part of her “balanced report”. Where is the gun safety training? Or training on the legal and moral aspect of self-defense? It doesn’t exist in her world. She can only see benefit in restricting the rights of people rather than in enabling people to protect themselves.

But what really got my attention is the last paragraph quoted above about “smart guns”.

“Irremovable tracking number”? I think we call those serial numbers and have been required for decades. But “irremovable” is an impossible (or at least extremely impractical) requirement.

RFID tags cannot stop a gun from firing. The sentence, “…inclusion of RFID (radio frequency identification) tags on guns that allow them only to fire if read by a corresponding chip worn by the owner…” is nonsensical. A RFID tag is little more than a fancy bar code. RFID tags cannot inhibit the firing of a gun. RFIDs can be made more secure than bar codes and hence less likely to be copied but at best she has thing backwards. If she had said a chip in the gun read the RFID tag worn by the owner then it would have least made sense. But that does not get around the issue brought up by NSSF (see below). The gun then clearly has to have a power supply which is subject to failure.

I am convinced these people believe in magic. Engineering is limited by the physical laws of the universe. They believe we can just cast some spell and make something happen. I understand the (especially supersonic) flight of airplanes, internal combustion engines, electric motors, GPS, the near instantaneous communication of email, television, and cellphones are all beyond the comprehension of most people. And I can understand guns could easily be dumped into the same mental magic box. Most people seek out experts and many of them actually respect the opinions of the expects. These people don’t. They did seek out the opinions of some gun manufactures and the NSSF. They even quoted them:

Beretta issued the following statement regarding smart guns:

As the leading designer and manufacturer of high-quality firearms in the world, Beretta has recently been asked by several news organizations about the feasibility and advisability of making handguns that include so-called “smart gun” technology or “personalized” internal locks. Beretta has considered this issue for several years and has concluded that existing design concepts of this type are neither advisable nor feasible.
Although the concept of a “smart gun” or “personalized gun” has received public attention recently, we believe that careful consideration has not been given to potentially dangerous risks associated with these concepts. In our opinion, such technology is undeveloped and unproven. In addition, Beretta strongly believes that “smart gun” technology or “personalized” guns… could actually increase the number of fatal accidents involving handguns.

And:

The National Shooting Sports Foundation in the United States, which is the trade association for the gun industry, still claims on its website that personalized guns are ill advised, citing the 1996 Sandia report that focused on police weapons:

“Personalized” or “smart gun” technology, while in development stages, is neither reliable nor available. A U.S. Department of Justice-funded project, researched by Sandia National Laboratories, concluded, “There is not currently a perfect smart gun technology.” Owner recognition technology, such as fingerprint recognition or a radio transmitter, requires a power source to work. Any technology that relies on a power source will fail, possibly at the worst time imaginable.

They then go on to dismiss these experts without addressing the fundamental issues of concern. That is demonstration of either crap for brains or deliberate deception. Hence this report and Congresswoman Kelly should be treated accordingly.—Joe]

Gun cartoon of the day

GunCrimeData

Wow!

That’s some serious projection on the part of an anti-gun person. Gun ownership and sales have been increasing while violent crime has been decreasing. But they say we don’t want to look at the data?

Yeah, right. Someone has mental problems and it’s those people who want to restrict our specific enumerated right to keep and bear arms. Facts get in the way of their agenda.

Random thought of the day

If putting serial numbers on bullets is a good idea to help solve crimes involving guns wouldn’t it also be a good idea to put them on prescription pills to track down whoever is supplying those who abuse those drugs? Or how about serial numbers on cigarettes to help prevent cigarettes from getting into the hands of underage smokers? Or tracking the serial numbers on paper money to combat the recreational drug trade?

The answer is no to all these ideas. Anyone that suggests serial numbers on bullets is as stupid and/or ignorant as someone who suggests serial numbers be tracked on the other items.

Quote of the day—John Walsh

I’ve suggested to the NRA that if they continue to terrorize Congress and they want everyone to have an AR-15 or an AK-47, that in the stock of that gun you should implant a GPS chip. It has nothing to do with civil liberties — just put in them what I have in my cellphone and what you and everyone has. When I lost my iPad they activated it and tracked it down and I went, ‘This works.’ So if you put this GPS in that AK-47 and a responsible owner gets robbed, now you can catch the dirt bag selling it to the illegal gang-banger, the guy who committed those 11 murders in Chicago. Forget about civil liberties — if you use a credit card, you’re already in Big Brother’s computer.

John Walsh
July 11, 2014
10 things John Walsh said about gun control, the NRA and more
[GPS chip? And then what? It also needs the cellphone modem, the battery, the antennas, and the account with the cell phone provider. This is so easy to defeat that a fourth grader could do it. And that assumes the battery wasn’t already dead when the gun was stolen.

Which is it “It has nothing to do with civil liberties?” Or is it “Forget about civil liberties?”

The government having your credit card history is small potatoes compared to the government being able to track the movement of your guns in real time. And who says it’s okay for Big Brother to have your credit card history?

The other nine things Walsh said were just as stupid as this one.—Joe]

Quote of the day—Rolf

They do not care about productive contributions. They are about marginalizing, hatred, bigotry, and challenging any threat to their worldview. They are like a teenager who KNOWS!!1! they are right. They have their stereotypes, and will cling to them tightly, because like a vampire fears sunlight these sorts of minds fear reality; they know outside their temporary bubble, where they imagine they are safe because the illusion has been going on for so long, they wouldn’t stand a chance, and that thought terrifies them. SO, rather than face their fears, they retreat further into their imaginary world, where the law IS the effect, where the average person is bad but government people are good, where real independence is bad and dependence is good, where things are good or evil, and where facts and ethics are all relative.

Rolf
July 14, 2014
Comment to Quote of the day—Qrys Bin Thynkn (@QrysBinThynkn)
[In this particular case I agree completely with Rolf but perhaps not in more general instances. This particular immature, name calling, bigot read my blog post about him and continued with the penis insults on Twitter here, here, and here:

The fact that you felt the need to single out my quote tells everyone that you do, in fact, have a small penis. ;-)

And you still comment. LOL!! Must be really small. ;-)

Do you think these small penis gun advocates realize by ripping into my post they are basically admitting they have a small penis?

Logic and facts are beyond the capability of this guy. There is no such thing as debate using facts, benefits versus hazards, or rights versus reasonable regulation. It about delivering the last lame insult.

I guess you have to play the hand you were dealt. And if that is all that you have you do the best you can with it. But it’s still a losing hand.—Joe]

Quote of the day—John Prager

With conservatives’ obsession with guns there is no more surefire way to make oneself a god amongst the Teabilly crowd than to lure them in with a smile and an AR-15. On Thursday, Clint Didier, a Tea Party Republican, announced that he will be giving away two Ruger 2300 LC9 pistols and a DB-15 S rifle in an effort to gain support in his bid for retiring Washington Rep. Doc Hastings. Hastings is just the latest to prey upon conservatives’ paranoid ‘Yer not gonna git mah guns’ attitude. Who else has joined in this new tradition of winning over stupid people with weaponry?

John Prager
June 21, 2014
Death Dealers: Pathetic GOP Candidates Are Giving Away Assault Rifles to Buy Votes
[If the title of the article were actually true then wouldn’t they have to give a select fire rifle to everyone who agreed to vote for them? Or would it be one for each community and they would share it?

The entire article is filled with logical and factual errors. Did you catch the error above where he says “bid for retiring Washington Rep. Doc Hastings”? I didn’t know you could bid on people. Is Hasting going to be Didier’s slave if he has the winning bid?

Yet he thinks we are the stupid ones. Mr. Prager, Have you ever heard of projection?—Joe]

Quote of the day—Ana Marie Cox

Activists such as those at Everytown need to redraw focus away from the infrequent horror of mass shootings and get voters to recognize the daily tragedies of gun violence. A taller order, but just as necessary: make clear that the gun violence is not about violent people with guns – it’s about guns, period.

There is no such thing as a neutral position on guns, because there is no such thing as a neutral gun. Guns have one purpose: to kill things. They are no more neutral than a poison. They can be used for good or ill, but the reason they exist is to hurt someone. In the “bad guy with a gun” versus a “good guy with a gun” scenario, the problem isn’t who’s bad and who’s good, it’s that there is a gun involved, period.

Ana Marie Cox
July 8, 2014
This Is The Real Reason Gun Control Is Failing
[By this logic the police shouldn’t have guns either then because it doesn’t matter if they are a good guy with a gun or a bad guy with a gun. I have to conclude Cox has some sort of mental disorder to have their thinking this messed up.

In any case don’t ever let anyone get away with telling you that no one wants to take your guns away. As well as not letting clearly crazy people possess guns we shouldn’t let crazy people take our guns.—Joe]