Secession, Not if, But What Now?

Interesting point:

In many ways, America is already broken apart. When secession is portrayed in its strictest sense, as a group of people declaring independence and taking a portion of a nation as they depart, the discussion is myopic, and current acts of exit hide in plain sight. When it comes to secession, the question is not just “What if?” but “What now?”

I’m not sure I even have a reasonable guess to answers for the questions posed.

I could possibly see the Federal government collapsing due to the debt crisis and no individual states claiming responsibility. But that is about it. And then what happens? Do the Federal Assets get auctioned off to the highest bidders to pay off some fraction of the national debt?

It’s a big mess.


9 thoughts on “Secession, Not if, But What Now?

  1. Secession is NOT going to happen. What the Fed Gov did in 1861 is ample proof of what they are willing to do to prevent it. The USA may balkanize after the government collapses to the point of virtual nonexistence but seceding from it isn’t going to happen. And by the time we reach the point of balkanization things everywhere will ugly. REALLY ugly.

    • But why did Lincoln do that? He was quite clear that it wasn’t about ending slavery but preserving the Union. But why was it worth killing a million people, wrecking half the country and ending the Republic of the Founders. Until we understand that, we cannot reason by analogy as to what will happen next. Certainly there have been cases internationally of peaceful separation (Czechoslovakia and any number of decolonization actions), cases of low level violence (Soviet Union and other decolonization actions), all out wars (US twice, Ireland), all out wars complete with genocide (South Africa and Ireland again) and peaceful separation followed by by mass violence (India).

      Nothing is inevitable. It’s a choice.

      • Re peaceful separation: another one, earlier, is Norway from Sweden (1905), an event that I believe is still remembered annually as a good example. An example involving at least low level violence was the separation of Belgium from Holland (1830).

        On the US case, that’s a very good question. Lincoln said plainly that he would accept slavery to preserve the union. Given the language of the Constitution it’s quite debatable whether he had the authority to take that view. I think a way to answer that question is to start by dropping the notion of Lincoln sainthood, and asking yourself whether he was acting as a big-government power hungry politician trying to preserve government power. Some of his actions, such as the suspension of parts of the Bill of Rights, support that view.

  2. It is possible to argue that 7 Southern states seceded because of a threat to slavery. The other 4 seceded because Lincoln attempted to make them participate in the suppression of the 7.

  3. Separate how exactly? All they have is a few blue cities. They have never been interested in doing anything in red states.
    They just want to control them.
    It’s a religion of domination.
    Salem and Portland own all of eastern Oregon. With resources and riches in abundance.
    It being turned into a waste land.
    There is no separating, you either kneel to their demands or you don’t. With whatever comes afterward.
    The king couldn’t give a shit less about the deer. He just wanted to hang you at a whim, and he wanted you to know that he could. And the boundaries of his rule are only kept in check by those as willful and well-armed as he is.
    You can’t separate yourself from someone with that attitude without someone dying.
    We could cut out the blue hives and make them change government in a couple of months. And they have proven undoubtingly they will kill us without conscience on a whim.
    But a lot of people are going to die one way or another. And we ain’t living in America as two separate countries. Everything they require to live comes from us.
    It’s just not humanly possible.

  4. “Do the Federal Assets get auctioned off to the highest bidders to pay off some fraction of the national debt?”

    Ever wonder why there are so many federal restricted ‘wildernesses’, ‘monuments’, ‘preserves’ wetf, that quite many just happen to cover areas that are known to be rich in natural mineral resources?

    Sure, right now federal law prohibits sale of the lands or restricts mining leases, but what happens when the day comes that there is no possible way for Uncle to pay even the yearly interest on the National debt?

    I’m not the only one of the opinion that ‘with sincere deep regret’ yada-yada-yada, the federal goobermint will sell off all rights to those who hold the debt instruments.

    • I can only imagine the effect such a sale would have on the NGO’s that delight in telling others what to do with their property, like the Sierra Club. Millions of leftist heads exploding as one, unable to send letters out begging for money to fight the inevitable.
      The Sierra Club sends out begging letters now, saying they need it to protect wilderness.

    • For that matter, it would be interesting to imagine the states moving to enforce Article 1 Section 8, next to last clause. The part that gives the Federal government authority over “Places… purchased by the consent of the Legislature of the State…for the erection of Forts, Magazines…”

      No mention of national parks in there. So between that point and the absence of state consent, the states have a good case for declaring all so-called “Federal lands” to be unowned property that will for the time being be administered by each state. Military bases are a different matter, but there is no Constitution authority for such notions as “half of Nevada is Federal land”.

      • It is more like 80% of Nevada but that includes some very large military bases and military-adjacent stuff like the Nevada Test Site. There are also a number of large Indian reservations which arguably are authorized by the Constitution (Article One, Section 8). That leaves National Parks, National Forests, the BLM and wildlife refuges. Nevada and all Western states were blackmailed into this as a condition for statehood.

Comments are closed.