In my legal opinion the Rare Breed Triggers FRT is a perfectly legal, semi-automatic, drop-in trigger. And my opinion is further supported by the opinions of whom I believe to be two of the most significant subject matter experts in the industry.
Rare Breed Triggers FRT – Full Video from RARE BREED TRIGGERS on Vimeo.
December 2, 2020
[As Greg said in a private post on Facebook:
pretty genius, I doubt it will last long on the market.
If you’re into this type of fun then get them while they last!
FRT is an acronym standing for “Forced Reset Trigger”. And that tells you all you need to know to have your giggle box kicked over.
We live in interesting times.—Joe]
At first glance, it would appear that the operation of the fcg is less questionable legally than the operation of currently available “binary” triggers. Very interesting indeed.
Unfortunately his opinion (or mine) doesn’t matter. Only the ATF’s opinion matters. As we’ve seen before their opinion can and has changed at a whim (bump stocks any one?). With a probable Biden administration that advocates a total “Assault Weapons” ban, there will be no restraint on the ATF. If anything this will be used to propagandize the claim that any semi-auto can be “readily converted” to a machine gun. With Roberts defecting to the left, and the SCOTUS’s historic unwillingness to directly overturn ATF regulations, coupled with the fact that this is a new device and therefore not “in common use” I wouldn’t expect judicial relief.
At this point it is arguable whether judicial relief is/should be the end goal. Forcing them to openly propose a ban on semi-auto in contravention to the law-as-written could be a tipping point, and effectively make these laws moot simply due to widespread defiance.
Arguably that is what we are doing already, as the letter-of-the-law innovation in this space has made many provisions moot from a functionality perspective. Every new innovation simply drives that point further home.
Now you can certainly argue that they will simply move to enforcement in an arbitrary and capricious manner, ignoring people who are not making waves and targeting people who publicize “forbidden information”, but I think our tolerance for that is rapidly declining and we have more people than ever voicing support to -ahem- “get the party started”. Everything the government does to show they do not give a damn about the rule of law is another dangerous step towards that end. The only question is if they realize it or not.
I see this as one more step in the education of the masses that our Federal government (and many state governments) does not care about the rule of law. This could be part of the justification for a national divorce between those who desire the rule of law and those that desire the selective use of the law to punish the politically incorrect (non-woke, out of favor, etc.) as in Ayn Rand’s observation.
Didn’t trigger slap used to be a thing on garbage grade import surplus crap or AKs that had been mutilated by the guys at Century Arms? I thought one of the things the Tapco triggers did was make this go away!
Yeah, this is ‘trigger slap’, but it’s controlled trigger slap.
They just figured out a way to keep the trigger from being pulled until the bolt was locked so you won’t get an out of battery slam fire.
Totally legal. And fun as it gets. But just like the last election and bump stocks, Bushmaster/ Remington and Sandy hook.. Law is just something for us constitutional deplorables to fantasy over. If it doesn’t fit the communist agenda. It has no place.
For the communist this will be as palatable as a turd in their punch bowl. And fear it will not be tolerated.
Great invention, bad timing.
But. If anyone is feeling charitable this Christmas? I could certainly use a couple of them!
Rule of law. How can the Federales be motivated to change the mortgage laws for the Lickspittle Leftist voters so they realize that they signed contracts and gave reams of disclosure documents, but when it comes to Leviathan’s convenience, the law and precedent mean nothing. Not that we could trust them to honor OUR precedential concerns, but someone should be able to make the connection and find that clause in the Constitution forbidding interference with contract. Once they discover the precedent lets the government do as they please (Gold Clauses, anyone?) we can tell them, too bad, so sad.
From their web site: “Full-Auto Bolt Carrier Required.” Which it appears they don’t sell.
Are full auto bolt carriers available for less than a gazillion dollars? The trigger itself is $380, so if the bolt carrier is hard to find and expensive as well, this seems like it could get really pricey….
Assuming you can find the bolt carrier you need, are there any other parts that should get replaced at the same time so you don’t end up with failures from parts that weren’t designed for high rates of fire?
I didn’t think I needed another AR receiver, but I could be talked into it…
Most AR15 BCG are Full Auto these days. The difference is the length of the opening at the bottom of the bolt carrier. The Full Auto style uses that piece to trip the auto-sear. The AR15 carrier isn’t long enough to trip an auto sear.
I have one AR15 style from the height of the AWB. The current feeling is that the extra mass of a full auto bolt carrier improves the reliability of the AR15.
The only way I would be comfortable about the FRT is if they had a determination letter from the ATF. It is the sort of thing I would expect. It doesn’t mean the ATF won’t change their minds in the future, but it does show that at the time of purchase, I purchased something that was “legal”.
I’m also concerned with the third pin. The ATF has ruled multiple times that putting the third hole in an AR15 receiver makes it a “machine gun”. The drop in auto-sear has that third hole (and pin) as part of the auto-sear. This trigger assembly has something that has the third hole, has a dingus that acts very much like an auto sear, and is activated in the same way as the drop in auto-sear and the auto-sear of a Full Auto function.
All of this means that there are more questions than I have money to pay a lawyer for if the ATF decides the lawyer for Rare Breed Triggers is talking through his hat.
We had a letter from the BATF that bumpstocks were legal on display in our gun shop.. There was a copy of that letter in every box bumpstocks came in. Having a letter means nothing to these people.
You don’t a third hole in your receiver for a drop-in auto-sear. Just all the standard M-16 lower parts and bolt carrier.
The sear on this trigger does not trip the hammer like a full-auto.
It just allows you to keep constant pressure on the trigger so the trigger is pulled again. Interesting distinction. But I’ve watched the BATF do this before.
Once they get several million into production, With orders flooding in from every where. The ATF hammer comes down.
The ATF is just making sure they won’t have enough money to fight, or start up with something else later.
The thing is, that ‘dingus’ isn’t a sear. It’s a doesn’t control the hammer. It controls the trigger, keeping it from moving -‘functioning’- again by the trigger finger (or anything else) until the carrier is forward and the bolt is locked.
While ATF may try to employ pretzel logic again, this method avoids the US Code definition of how a machinegun fires more than one round “by a single function of the trigger” (my italics)
The ease with which people find a work around and loophole in their wonderfully shiny laws must keep them awake even a little bit. After all, now they have to actually work, by writing new regulations and publish a letter explaining why this is a machine gun. Something for hundreds of lawyers and engineers to pore over, seeking another loophole.
They’d better not call it a sear, and it had better not be able to be swapped with a sear, even if it’s in a completely different place of the trigger group.
Did I say how much I love to see these exploitations of loopholes? There is nothing sweeter than using your opponents cases to defeat his argument.
it isn’t how fast the gun operates. it is how quickly the shooter acquires and fires upon a target.
please remember, alvin york did just fine with a bolt action rifle, at fairly intimate distances. and, he didn’t have to kill a very high percentage of the soldiers that surrendered to him, when he demonstrated to their satisfaction that he could & would kill almost everyone he did shoot at.
Yes, but Alvin York was shooting the soldiers in October 1918. The German Army was ready to quit. The Russians was off the field, having already replaced the Czar, the Soviets had replaced Kerensky. The French Army had already mutinied, the Italian Army was occupying Sud Tirol, the Austro-Hungarian Army had already gone home, and the newly demobilized soldiers were stealing sugar and flour and any other foodstuffs off the trains to sell on the black market I’m surprised that York had to shoot more than one of them to get them all to quit. Maybe he couldn’t find an officer.
mechanically, however, quite interesting.
All quite clever! Rather than focus on the meaning and value of the second amendment, and the principles of liberty from which the amendment arises, they have us focusing on the technical details of what makes a firearm work, and on the anti-constitutional rules they presume to have the authority to impose. Very clever indeed. And see how well it’s working!
Demonstrating the futility of their efforts and laughing at the enemies of liberty is a means of defeating them.
sometimes we are our own worst enemy…the atf almost took braces away last week, now this…just what we need with a possible biden admin already wanting to ban AR’s or at the min, tax us out of them…
They were always planning to come for your AR, regardless of whether or not bump stocks, binary triggers, forced reset triggers or pistol braces were a thing.
Because illegal guns are used in minority communities to kill other minorities? Or just because they don’t like people with guns or is it just people with legal guns?